Boat Building Forum

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Re: Some ideas to ponder
By:Wayne
Date: 10/2/2001, 10:33 am
In Response To: Some ideas to ponder (Paul G. Jacobson)

Many thanks for a thoughtful and detailed reply. I've had to digest it over quite a number of readings. Some newbie questions continue (and thanks for your patience!)

: There are plenty of plans and lines available for free in books and
: magazines.

Assuming that I'd make my ribs out of heat-bent PVC, where would you suggest I go for a template for my ribs to produce a boat that did well on the water? (if I'm going to do the PVC thing, why not stay with just the one material?)

: By nthe way, you can buy the book [Putz] and use that design. It
: is a good one. I have a webpage that translates his drawing into useful
: coordinates for making building forms with a minimum of wood.

Would Putz' book give me rib templates? I've got Morris' book and am considering using some of his measurement rules. I'm interested in your site as well - can you share the link?

: Go to Klepper's website and you'll see that they do the same thing by tying
: together the upper and lower longitudinal member on each side with
: rectangles of thin baltic birch plywood. (www.klepper.com)

Good point. They also have a partial plywood floor. Should I consider that as well?

: With PVC pipe you need to add similar crossbracing. Here is what I have
: considered. Make a jig that will SECURELY hold a 45 degree angle PVC
: fitting. With the fitting in this jig you should be able to safely run it
: through a table saw so that you can cut open one leg of the fitting. Make
: two for each brace. Shove the untouched ends of the fittings on a short
: piece of tubing. This will be your brace. The ends you have cut open you
: should be able to glue onto the sides of the longitudinal pieces.

So the ends of these angled braces would be permanently attached to the long pieces, and the "short tubing" could be dismantled?

I seem to recall reading that too much PVC glue actually weakens the material, so I think I'd want to limit my use of it. What do you think about making a jig that supported the PVC pipe, then using a drill of the proper diameter to essentially "cut" through the pipe. This would give me a rounded end that would mate very nicely with it's intended long piece. Thoughts?

: The only real trick is to get the length of the short piece of tubing to be
: exactly right so the brace can fit at exactly 45 degrees where it is
: installed. Try fitting each one and adjusting the length a bit at a time.
: When you have it right, slosh on the solvent and cement the thing solidly
: together. What fits on the left side should be exactly the same for the
: right side, so cut one and fit it, then cut the one for the other side to
: exactly the same length. Install both before going on to the next pair of
: braces, which should be close in size. Whatever the length of one brace
: is, the one next to it should be about the same size. Probably no more
: than 1/8th inch difference between adjacent braces.

I agree they'd need to be the same length. But I'd want to be able to dismantle it all somehow. Are you thinking that I'd build this "truss" (hope I got the term right), and then have joints in it? In other words, say 4 "mini-trusses" that join to create the full length one? (And, sure, it would undoubtedly make more sense to build a boat that can't be dismantled first - as a learning exercise. But if I was sensible, would I really be doing half the things I do anyways?)

: There should be plenty of remaining plastic on the fitting to make a strong
: bond with the longitudinal member, but there may be a ridge or bump on the
: inside of the fitting that will need to be removed by aggressive sanding,
: filing, or maybe the use of a router. You would definitely want to secure
: your fitting in a secure jig if you tried to remove the excess material
: with powertools.

I think that severing it by drilling through would take care of this, no?

: If you want to emulate the Klepper idea, find a supplier of PVC sheet stock
: and cut rectangles from 1/8th inch stock or thicker. Use the cement to
: solvent bond these to the inside of the longitudinals.

This may be the simpler method by far. Anyone have an idea where I could find PVC sheet stock?

: The cost of the materials is not too great, and the time to make them is
: not very great. Play with this a bit.

That's part of the appeal to me.

: You could also make ribs from your PVC pipe. It bends easily when heated.

Need I be concerned about weakening of the PVC from heating? What do you think the best method of heating and working with the pipe would be?

: You
: would need some sort of form to work from >
:You mention nesting the ribs so the packing is
: smaller

I wonder if I could make my first large rib using a form cut out of that really thick cardboard used for packing appliances (the 3" stuff). Then use rib one as the exterior form for rib two, and so on - each concentric circle providing the form for creating the next. Might this work? Potential pitfalls?

: Consider making ribs that go at an angle

Or could I go back and add cross members (not sure that'd be the right term) at an angle if it turned out that the boat was not rigid enough?

Regarding skin, you said,
: If
: you lace the bow end of the boat you can keep an eye on the laces while
: you are paddling, and fix things should the skin or lace stretch and allow
: the fabric to become slack.

I like this a lot. And I'm guessing I'd have the lace secured up by the cockpit so I could adjust it and tighten it up while in the boat and on the water?

: Hope this helps. Hapy building

It helps a lot - I can't tell you how much I appreciate your noodling this one along with me. Perhaps someday I'll be of help to another newbie. (And I do have the bug in a big way. After making this take apart boat, I fully intend to build a more respectable S&G vessel - the photos I've seen on this board are too compelling not to!)

Again, many thanks,
Wayne

Messages In This Thread

Collapsible(?), Cheap(?), Kayak idea
Wayne -- 9/28/2001, 1:21 pm
Some ideas to ponder
Paul G. Jacobson -- 9/30/2001, 6:57 pm
Re: Some ideas to ponder
Wayne -- 10/2/2001, 10:33 am
Putz walrus graphing points URL
Paul G. Jacobson -- 10/3/2001, 6:49 pm
Re: Some ideas to ponder
Paul G. Jacobson -- 10/3/2001, 5:08 am
Re: Collapsible(?), Cheap(?), Kayak idea
Warwick Carter -- 9/29/2001, 5:03 pm
Re: Collapsible(?), Cheap(?), Kayak idea
mike allen ---> -- 9/28/2001, 9:03 pm
Careful!...
Nathan -- 9/28/2001, 3:06 pm
Re: Careful!... *Pic*
Roger Nuffer -- 9/29/2001, 2:57 am
Re: Careful!...
Wayne -- 9/28/2001, 3:46 pm
Re: Careful!...
Nathan -- 9/28/2001, 6:11 pm