George,

I guess we aren't comparing apples to apples. I buy 8" by 18' western red cedar from lumber yards/hardware stores for 15 dollars per board. It costs me only 60 dollars in lumber to build a 17' kayak. Composites cost me 300 dollars including epoxy and glass. I use approximately two and a half gallons of resin/hardener per boat. I lay the glass on, fill the weave with one coat, then apply two more coats. Let me know your technique for using only 3/4 gallon of epoxy/hardener. Is there something I'm missing he
re?!
Thanks,
Bryan C.
t: The cost reply was to Robert Cochrane's suggestion that the wood be replaced by more expensive composite materials, aircraft honeycombs I believe. But wood is the major cost even in a low cost boat:

: The cost of materials in a boat are along the lines of
: wood - $200 + shipping (50 bd ft 1x6 S4S white cedar)
: epoxy - $50 (1/2 gal epoxy + 1/4 gal hardener MAS)
: fiberglass - $100 (25yd)
: varnish - $20 (1 qt throw out the left overs)
: glue $5 (2 qt)
: disposible materials - $100 (paint brushes, roller covers, shop rags, clothes washing soap)

: While you can lay a whole boat in a day. It takes me 1-2 hours to lay 4 strips well , 2 on each side of the keel. But then I don't do any planing and I do little sanding.
: If I build 2 boats at once, I can move back and forth between them and it still takes a whole week to strip 2 boats.

: As for stiffness, you cannot detect stiffness difference between a 1/4" strip boat with a aft bulkhead and a 1/8" stip boat with an aft bulkhead. The difference in my deflection tests is less than 1% well below the accepted 3% that individuals can detect, and the same as the 1% variation that is expected from the use of different epoxies.
: Epoxy stiffness differences are due to diffent epoxies, different speeds of hardners, and post cure heat treating.

: : : Actually cost and time are very important to me.

: : : 1/8" strips cost 2/3 the amount of 1/4" strips (more strips per inch) once you get the technique correct (lower the scrap rate).

: : : I can lay 1/8" strips much faster than 1/4" strips.
: : : In particular I have to pause every set of 4 1/4" strips to let the glue set. I don't need to do that with 1/8" strips.

: : : And finally I want less stiffness not more.
: : : I was on Lake Superior this month and I beat a couple test boats on the rocks.
: : : The exterior cloth stretched, the center wood deformed, and the inner cloth held it all together.
: : : Almost like a good glass whitewater boat.

: :
: : George,

: : If cost is important to you, I would spend more time finding ways to reduce the cost of composites, not wood. the cedar we use for hulls/decks is very cheap relative to the epoxy!! I use 1/4" strips because for a sea/touring kayak siffness is important for speed/efficiency. I also use this thickness because it gives me a fudge factor when fairing the boat before glassing. I staple my strips so no matter what size you use, you could strip the entire hull/deck in one day.