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Re: one last shot at changing your mind :)
By:Thomas Duncan
Date: 12/31/2004, 9:57 pm
In Response To: one last shot at changing your mind :) (Paul G. Jacobson)

Part of the function of the bow and stern toggles are to allow you to hold onto the boat if you ever have to bail out.

The idea of using a monkey fist knot on a single rope is a good one, but having that rope come out of the top of the deck seems odd from a safety standpoint. If I am reading your post right.

If you ever have to bail in the surf, and hang onto your boat, you want to be at one of the toggles with the boat streaming out in front of you with the flow of the water. If the kayak does a "death roll" on you in a breaker, make sure the rope you are holding onto is long enough so that the sharp end of the boat doesn't contact your hand or wrist as it twists. You'll be forced to let go, and depending on the circumstances, that could be a bad thing.

All depends on where you paddle. For my money, I'd put the rope through the hull, through a pipe or a drill-fill-drill hole so that it'd be easily replaced and in a better position to function as a hold-on point.

The monkey's fist on a single rope is good because you can't get your hand or fingers caught between two twisting strands of rope as on some of the more standard toggles.

My 2 cents. Good luck!

: But perhaps not persuasive enough :)

: If you do not saturate the entire length of the rope then water will get in
: through capillary action. It gets in fairly fast and takes much longer to
: evaporate and get out. meanwhile, mold grows and makes the area green and
: smelly. Try a sample. Take your rope, with the epoxy trated ends, and
: submerge it in water with a little ink mixed in. If you don't have ink
: handy, use some old red wine or grape juice. Let it sit for an hour, as
: you'll certainly be on the water for longer than that. see how far into
: the fibers the color of the grapejuice/wine/ink has travelled. If you use
: clear epoxy and white rope the effect will be more easily seen.

: When my shoelaces break it is always at a point where they go into an eyelet.
: The constant wear at just one point will weaken the rope faster than if
: the rope can move. Over time all methods of attachment will be compromised
: by the gradual weakening of the rope. It is not going to be an instant
: problem, just one that will need to be addressed sooner rather than later.

: If you have followed my posts over the years you'll know how much I enjoy
: sanding (not at all!) with your rope glued in you will have to be careful
: will all sanding operations of any varnish that will be aplied over the
: net few years. nicking the rope with sandpaper will definitely weaken it a
: bit, and cause unsightly fraying and fuzzies. With just a hole there you
: can sand over the area quickly and neatly, and then pop in a fresh piece
: of rope to make the boat look spiffy. Rope is fairly cheap, but when it
: gets ratty it is the boat owner who looks cheap for not replacing it.

: The mushy rope is going to be a very flimsy guide for your drill bit. You
: will get an odd shaped hole unless you can get the boat under a drill
: press, or some other method of substantially bracing the drill itself.
: Instead of getting a clean hole you'll just be ripping out shreds of
: threads. A reamer would be a better tool if you happen to have one with
: you. In the end you will get a neat hole in the bow. Why not start with
: one now and avoid the mess later?

: The toggles or grab loops at the ends of a kayak are the only deck points
: that are designed to be strong enough to lift the boat--unless you have
: added something different. It makes sense to attach the boat at its
: strongest points. If you try them you'll find them very convenient for
: holding the boat in place.

: Most people who have cradles use bow and stern lines for insurance,
: connecting their boat and their car. When you carry the boat in cradles or
: on a rack, you will probably use two straps over the boat. Should one of
: those straps fail, or even loosen, the tension on the other strap,
: combined with wind resistance, will cause the boat to shift. Then those
: extra lines come into play, keeping the boat on the roof (or on the
: trailer) while you slow down and stop to fix the matter.

: A friend of mine lost an aluminum canoe (not his) in '97 when a strap broke
: and it was blown off of the trailer he was towing. By the time he was able
: to get off the road the canoe had been hit by a semi, which fortunately
: knocked it off the roadway so that cars didn't run into it, too. The semi
: wasn't seriously damaged (which could have been a major insurance issue)
: but the canoe was totalled. Since he was on a major highway, with a
: trailer, about 1.2 mile past the wrecked canoe, he had to continue several
: miles to an exit, get off, and then get back on the road in the other
: direction, drive back past the site of the incident to another exit, and
: finally come up behind where the boat had taken flight. He had to get the
: wrecked canoe back on the trailer--which it no longer wanted to fit
: on--and go explain the situation to the owners. It spoiled his day.

: Well, that's my opinion. Twice. So I'll get off my soapbox now.

: I hope this helps, but I don't want to stifle your creativity or
: inventiveness. You may be on to something which will change MY mind.

: PGJ

Messages In This Thread

S&G: Top load dooky schmutz end pour
Obee -- 12/24/2004, 2:03 pm
Re: S&G: Top load dooky schmutz end pour
Paul G. Jacobson -- 12/29/2004, 10:08 pm
Re: S&G: Top load dooky schmutz end pour
Obee -- 12/30/2004, 1:54 pm
one last shot at changing your mind :)
Paul G. Jacobson -- 12/31/2004, 12:52 am
Re: one last shot at changing your mind :)
Thomas Duncan -- 12/31/2004, 9:57 pm
End pour
bryan gorr -- 12/25/2004, 6:34 am
Re: End pour
Obee -- 12/25/2004, 2:28 pm
Re: End pour *Pic*
bryan gorr -- 12/26/2004, 9:59 am
Erruption Possibility *Pic*
Lloyd E. Peterson -- 12/24/2004, 2:46 pm
Re: Erruption Possibility
Obee -- 12/24/2004, 3:38 pm
Re: Erruption Possibility
LeeG -- 12/24/2004, 4:51 pm