Date: 1/31/2002, 9:31 pm
...they got confused again. I wrote the following email to Mr. Smith at CPES:
> I have a technical question about CPES. I used CPES to good effect on
>restoration of a historic log house in Seattle, and am sold on the product.
>This question is about my cedar strip kayak building hobby, and other builders
>are anxiously awaiting resolution of some questions.
>
> I built a new Western red cedar kayak paddle, saturated as per Rot Doctor
>instructions 3 times wet-on-wet to rejection, which took about 1 hour. This >was all done last November, with ambient temp about 45 here in Seattle, high
>humidity, and using the Cold Weather version of the product. That was on a
>Tuesday. The following Sunday, there was a mild lingering odor but the surface
>felt hard. There was no discoloration, cloudiness or other indicia of the >blush that we get with layup epoxies.
>
> I took the stick to rolling practice at a swimming pool. When immersed in >the pool water, a slime developed that made the stick really slippery. It was
>totally unexpected. I took it out of the pool, hosed it off outside and the
>slime melted right away, and it has been fine ever since. But that raised a >big red flag for me. My observation is that whatever this film was, it >constitutes a potential bondbreaker for following coats. It does not act like >blush, but more like an oily residue. Have others experienced this >condition? Is it residue from the solvent evaporation? Could it be from >impurities in recycled solvents used in manufacture?
>
> It seems likely that this film would be a bondbreaker for any topcoats. >There is a discussion now on the premier wood sea kayak construction BBS
>(http://www.kayakforum.com/cgi-bin/Building/index.cgi) about using CPES as a
>sealer before applying the first layer of fiberglass. I proposed and >championed the idea, with the proviso that the film should be rinsed off >before applying the glass. Does this sound reasonable? How would you suggest >that we test for this condition and deal with it otherwise?
>
> BTW, I used to be in the epoxy floor application business, and have done >over 2 million sq. ft., so I'm up the learning curve on epoxy.
Mr. Smith promptly replied:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Hi, Pete
that sounds as if some of the residual solvents in the material and a trace of
not-fully-but-almost-cured material came to the surface. Remember , the
solvent system must be able to dissolve the water in wood, and so contains a
considerable amount of water-soluble solvents. The residual solvents do
diffuse out of the wood, and the "slime" was an emulsion of the
resin/residual-solvent system with water. It was cold, and so it would have
taken perhaps several weeks for the solvents to fully leave. Normally, one
proceeds from CPES-stabilized wood to some epoxy or polyurethane coating, or
epoxy laminating resin, and one does not immerse in
water.
You don't have to worry about "bone-breaking phenomena. In normal
circumstances it won't happen and doesn't , based on my 30 years of experience
with tens of thousands of users of my products."
Well, there you have it we don't have to worry about broken bones.
Messages In This Thread
- Epoxy: To Evaporate and Blush or not to .....
Joe -- 1/30/2002, 8:20 pm- Re: Epoxy: To Evaporate and Blush or not to .....
Steve Smith -- 2/1/2002, 4:38 pm- Thank you Mr. Smith
Pete Rudie -- 2/1/2002, 5:52 pm
- Re: Epoxy: To Evaporate and Blush or not to .....
Jim Chowning -- 2/1/2002, 10:40 am- Thanks for the answer
Pete Rudie -- 2/1/2002, 12:09 pm- Re: Thanks for the answer
Jim Chowning/The Rot doctor -- 2/1/2002, 12:55 pm- Re: Thanks for the answer
LeeG -- 2/1/2002, 1:41 pm- Re: Thanks for the answer
Jim Chowning/The Rot doctor -- 2/2/2002, 12:31 pm- Re: Thanks for the answer *Pic*
Pete Rudie -- 2/2/2002, 1:46 pm
- Re: Thanks for the answer *Pic*
- Re: Thanks for the answer
- Re: Thanks for the answer
- Re: Thanks for the answer
- Re: Epoxy: To Evaporate and Blush or not to .....
Severne -- 1/31/2002, 11:52 am- Just when things looked clear...
Pete Rudie -- 1/31/2002, 9:31 pm- Re: Just when things looked clear...
Joe -- 2/1/2002, 3:01 am- Re: you are a reasonable guy
LeeG -- 1/31/2002, 10:52 pm - Re: you are a reasonable guy
- Only 1/32" Penetration ???.....
Joe -- 1/31/2002, 2:40 pm- Re: Greater Penetration
Chip Sandresky -- 2/1/2002, 12:45 pm- Re: Only 1/32" Penetration ???.....
Pete Rudie -- 1/31/2002, 2:56 pm- Re: Only 1/32" Penetration ???.....
Nick Schade - Guillemot Kayaks -- 2/1/2002, 10:54 am- Good point. And it IS Softwood. *NM*
Joe -- 2/1/2002, 11:11 am
- however
mike allen ---> -- 1/31/2002, 3:05 pm- Re: however
Jim Chowning/The Rot doctor -- 2/1/2002, 7:36 pm- Re: however
Pete Rudie -- 1/31/2002, 6:22 pm- Re: however
mike allen ---> -- 1/31/2002, 6:38 pm
- I asked Dr.Rot to come and answer us HERE!
Joe -- 1/31/2002, 4:45 pm- Re: I asked Dr.Rot to come and answer us HERE!
Nick Schade - Guillemot Kayaks -- 2/1/2002, 10:49 am
- Re: however
- Re: Only 1/32" Penetration ???.....
LeeG -- 1/31/2002, 3:01 pm - Good point. And it IS Softwood. *NM*
- Re: Only 1/32" Penetration ???.....
- Re: Just when things looked clear...
- It's not really blush .....
Pete Rudie -- 1/31/2002, 1:40 am- But could it be . . .
Paul G. Jacobson -- 1/31/2002, 10:33 pm- Good point,
Pete Rudie -- 1/31/2002, 11:50 pm
- MORE than fair. Thanks *NM*
Joe -- 1/31/2002, 7:31 pm- Re: It's not really blush .....
Joe -- 1/31/2002, 3:04 am- Re: It's not really blush .....
LeeG -- 1/31/2002, 3:27 am- Re: Pure Speculation...
Nick Schade - Guillemot Kayaks -- 1/31/2002, 9:02 am- Re: Pure Speculation...
Tom Johansen -- 1/31/2002, 5:53 pm- Re: Pure Speculation...
LeeG -- 1/31/2002, 8:31 pm- Re: Pure Speculation...
Jim Chowning/The Rot doctor -- 2/1/2002, 2:01 pm- Re: Pure Speculation...
LeeG -- 2/1/2002, 5:17 pm
- Re: Pure Speculation...
- No speculation here...
Pete Rudie -- 1/31/2002, 6:15 pm- Dr. Rot replies ....
Joe -- 1/31/2002, 7:01 pm
- Re: Pure Speculation...
- Re: immaculate speculation
LeeG -- 1/31/2002, 2:56 pm- Limitations
Pete Rudie -- 1/31/2002, 11:21 am- Re: Limitations
Jim Chowning/The Rot doctor -- 2/1/2002, 1:49 pm- Re: Limitations
Nick Schade - Guillemot Kayaks -- 1/31/2002, 12:59 pm - Re: Limitations
- Re: More Speculation...
Shawn Baker -- 1/31/2002, 10:46 am - Re: Pure Speculation...
- Re: Pure Speculation...
- Re: Pure Speculation...
- Good point,
- Solving solvent worries
Paul G. Jacobson -- 1/30/2002, 10:50 pm- Re: Solving solvent worries
Joe -- 1/31/2002, 1:12 am- Re: Solving solvent worries
Jim Chowning/The Rot doctor -- 2/1/2002, 1:16 pm
- Re: Solving solvent worries
- Re: Epoxy: To Evaporate and Blush or not to .....
LeeG -- 1/30/2002, 8:54 pm- Re: Epoxy: To Evaporate and Blush or not to .....
Joe -- 1/30/2002, 10:13 pm- Re: Epoxy: To Evaporate and Blush or not to .....
LeeG -- 1/30/2002, 11:17 pm- Re: Epoxy: Good questions
don -- 1/30/2002, 10:48 pm- Re: Epoxy: To Evaporate and Blush or not to .....
Jon Murray -- 1/30/2002, 10:35 pm - Re: Epoxy: Good questions
- Re: Epoxy: To Evaporate and Blush or not to .....
- Thank you Mr. Smith
- Re: Epoxy: To Evaporate and Blush or not to .....